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What can we practice in a lucid dream?

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Martina Pesce
Martina Pesce Oct 16, 2020
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Given that training a motor task in a lucid dream leads to the skill improvement (in terms of neural skills underlying the motor skills),
what else could we practice in this state which is hard to do in waking life?

[1]D. Erlacher and M. Schredl, “Practicing a motor task in a lucid dream enhances subsequent performance: A pilot study,” Sport Psychol., 2010.

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Therapies, sleep learning, self-reflection

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jnikola
jnikola Oct 19, 2020
In my session, I focused on people`s ability to work/think/brainstorm while sleeping, but this goes a step further. I love the idea of using your "motor skills" while sleeping to improve your motor skills while being awake, but I would rather call them "neural skills underlying the motor skills". Tell me if I misunderstood.

  • Subconscious therapies for sociopaths to learn the right emotional patterns and behaviors
  • Recognizing the risky situations using AI-powered predefined scenarios (for security workers)
  • Self-reflection



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Martina Pesce
Martina Pesce4 years ago
I'll check out the session! Very cool point too!

About subconscious therapies, how would you imagine this?
I somehow feel like it may be risky to leave alone a sociopath with their subconscious for so long, without a therapist going throw it with them since the therapist could not enter the dream.
What do you think?
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jnikola
jnikola4 years ago
Martina Pesce hahaha now you found me unprepared to answer this.

I am not so into psychology, but I can try to describe what a meant by "sleep therapy" of sociopaths.

As I read, sociopaths are persons with traits of antisocial personality disorder - "disregard social rules and obligations, are irritable and aggressive, act impulsively, lack guilt, fail to learn from experience and can appear superficially charming." (https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/hide-and-seek/201205/the-10-personality-disorders)

I understand your safety concern because sociopaths are usually the most closely correlated with crime among all persons diagnosed with personality disorders. But, in terms of their own safety, sleep therapy shouldn`t be questionable because they are rarely dangerous for themselves (especially when sleeping and not using harmful substances).

Concerning the therapy itself, there are no medications for the treatment of this antisocial personality disorder, but psychotherapy or group-therapy could help.

Let`s imagine a patient falling into a deep sleep after taking a mood stabilizer to control impulsive and aggressive behavior or antipsychotic medications to target paranoia (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/320142#treatments). AI or expert-guided psychotherapy, in combination with some advanced techniques to channelize the brain activity while sleeping, could give positive results. If not because of the specific approach, then because of an additional session/hour with a psychotherapist.
Because there is no need for a patient to answer, the session can be taped and played while the patient is sleeping to reduce the costs.

It`s just a quickly conceived idea. I have no specific ideas of how to approach a patient from a psychological point, but maybe some psychologists (Anja M) could help here.
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Martina Pesce
Martina Pesce4 years ago
Juran K.
Put in this shape it sounds like a very cool idea!
indeed, I would love a psychologist opinion over here :)
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Consolidate physiotherapy, learn or improve in various sports, and memorize critical information with lucid dreams.

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Jamila
Jamila Oct 19, 2020
  • Rehabilitation for people with injuries – Individuals with physical injuries can use their physiotherapy sessions to help them improve. Practicing techniques in the lucid dream alongside their regular physiotherapy may help them improve further.
  • Sports – researchers showed that individuals could improve their performance in darts with lucid dreams. However, this did depend on the number of distractions they had during the dream. Those that had fewer distractions during the lucid dream had improved more. Darts is just one example. Lucid dreaming could be used to practice other sports like football, basketball, baseball, etc. This could be very useful for professional athletes.
  • Memorization – perhaps, we could prepare for an exam with the help of lucid dreams. We could study the learning material while awake and then try to memorize it in our lucid dream.
  • Ideation – We could try to think of new ideas in our lucid dreams. This isn’t unheard of, as many researchers have thought of novel ideas during their lucid dreams. Otto Loewi, a Nobel laureate, had designed an experiment in his dreams. The experiment later helped him to validate his theory that chemicals called neurotransmitters are involved in nerve impulses.

[1]Schädlich, Melanie, Daniel Erlacher, and Michael Schredl. “Improvement of darts performance following lucid dream practice depends on the number of distractions while rehearsing within the dream–a sleep laboratory pilot study.” Journal of sports sciences 35.23 (2017): 2365-2372.

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Martina Pesce
Martina Pesce4 years ago
About the memorization for exams: wouldn't it be a bit risky? Lucid dreams are still dreams and as such everything feels so strong and vivid. What if we repeat all other the night a piece of information that we actually initially stored incorrectly and then we end up with this strong vivid wrong information that we need to change.
Do you think this would be possible?
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Jamila
Jamila 4 years ago
Martina Pesce good point! It's possible to memorise the wrong information. So, it would be risky. I wonder if we could somehow minimise the risk of that happening.
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Jamila
Jamila 4 years ago
Also, researchers from MIT developed a way to stimulate specific lucid dreams. The person wears a device called Dormio, which will be used to track their sleep. Dormio detects when the wearer enters the sleep stage known as hypnagogia. Hypnagogia is where lucid dreaming can be stimulated. Dormio will then wake up the wearer with a voice note. For example, the voice note could prompt the person by saying ‘tree.’ Then the person should dream about trees!

The link: https://www.livescience.com/dream-manipulation-machine.html

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anger, music, refining specific techniques

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Martina Pesce
Martina Pesce Oct 16, 2020
I believe it would be a great way to
  • practice dealing with anger for those who struggle with it: it would prevent breaking things and injuring people
  • music creation: booking multiple musicians to play different instruments is expensive
  • military training
  • exercise for surgery students
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Establish a dialogue between the un- and the sub-conscious with the conscious

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Shubhankar Kulkarni
Shubhankar Kulkarni Oct 20, 2020
Our dreams are put together using random images from our subconscious mind - something that we have experienced lately or the memories that have been revisited due to recent experiences. Although debated, but there exists evidence that suggests that the subconscious plays an important part in the dreams we see and our behavior, probably as important as our conscious mind. Dreams are, therefore, the perfect bridge where the conscious can interact with the subconscious. This will help us understand the working of the sub-conscious mind and how it interacts with the conscious. We may be able to control one via the other (a far-fetched idea, reference - "Inception").

[1]Bargh J. A., Morsella E. (2008). The unconscious mind. Perspect. Psychol. Sci. 3 73–79. 10.1111/j.1745-6916.2008.00064.x

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Povilas S
Povilas S4 years ago
That's the idea/approach I'm most fascinated with. By learning to consciously control the dream, you are learning to control your subconscious. From a psychological/psychoanalytical point of view your subconscious is directly responsible for things that happen in your life - people you "attract", success/failures you have, etc. So by learning to control it in the dream you are making a big step towards learning to control it in general, which might be a very direct way of making huge changes in your life. But this takes some understanding of the mechanics of subconscious, how it's represented in the dream, what are you controlling in terms of subconscious mind, when you control the dream, etc.
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Martina Pesce
Martina Pesce4 years ago
Povilas S
In fact, it does look like lucid dreamers have deeper self-awareness than non-lucid dreams [1].

I was looking for some literature about this point specifically and couldn't find any.
Interesting how something so promisingly powerful is not studied that much!




References:
[1] Blagrove, M., & Hartnell, S. J. (2000). Lucid dreaming: Associations with internal locus of control, need for cognition and creativity. Personality and Individual Differences, 28(1), 41-47.
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Povilas S
Povilas S4 years ago
Martina Pesce It also depends on what you'll take into account - people that have a natural tendency to lucid dream more or those who practice it or both, etc. This article seems like comparing natural differences. But the great thing about it is that you can practice it and thus increase your self-awareness as a side effect:) But self-awareness seems like a powerful thing only to some people, not the majority I presume, hence the lack of study:)
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A pleasant way to wake up

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Martina Pesce
Martina Pesce Nov 06, 2020
Another thing they can help with is solving the problem of this section
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Choreography

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Nivari Van der Voorde
Nivari Van der Voorde Nov 09, 2020
Going through a dance choreography in your dream might help you to memorize it physically awake.
Actually, when I was around 12 years old, we went through a choreography so many times in dancing class, that now sometimes the choreography starts playing in my head spontaneously, even 16 years later!
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General comments

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Shubhankar Kulkarni
Shubhankar Kulkarni4 years ago
"Inception" comes to mind :)
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